[Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic response formulation
Keith Chapman
keith at wso2.com
Mon Nov 5 20:53:36 PST 2007
Jonathan Marsh wrote:
> Any status on this thread? I'm still worried our approach might compromise
> SOAP 1.2 interop.
>
Currently Axis2 does not handle the SOAP response map explicitly. Its
the responsibility of the author of the service to respond with SOAP
1.2 (Even for the WSDL 2.0 interop stuff I explicitly set this in the
service when it was a SOAP response mep).
Axis2 server side code generation does not look at the binding details,
rather it generates code based on the details in the interface. (I
wonder whether we need to bring the binding hierarchy in to play here
and generate server side code depending on the binding too. Amila might
have better insight on that though).
The proposal I made on Axis2 was that if the Accept header is set then
the response message will be formatted according the contentType of the
Accept header. But then again this is set before the serviceLogic runs,
so the user can override the contentType of the response message if he
wishes to do so.
So i dont see a problem with the SOAP response mep here.
Thanks,
Keith.
> Jonathan Marsh - http://www.wso2.com - http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: registry-dev-bounces at wso2.org [mailto:registry-dev-
>> bounces at wso2.org] On Behalf Of Jonathan Marsh
>> Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 1:50 PM
>> To: registry-dev at wso2.org
>> Subject: RE: [Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic response
>> formulation
>>
>> Hmmm, then I wonder if the SOAP 1.2 response MEP and the advice on
>> Accept
>> headers in the SOAP 1.2 Adjuncts spec [1] could have some implications.
>> Namely, that a SOAP 1.2 service that implements the SOAP Response MEP,
>> invoked by a client that ignores the MAYs and SHOULDs in that section
>> and
>> doesn't provide a suitable Accept header, would be expected to would
>> respond
>> to a envelope-free request with a SOAP 1.2 response envelope. A client
>> might rely on this behavior. Then when the REST/POX alternative is
>> engaged
>> at the server, the client will find himself getting XML instead of SOAP
>> responses back.
>>
>> I think the effect of this behavior would be to make the Accept header
>> mandatory for services that want to engage the new behavior. Am I
>> wrong?
>>
>> Jonathan Marsh - http://www.wso2.com -
>> http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: registry-dev-bounces at wso2.org [mailto:registry-dev-
>>> bounces at wso2.org] On Behalf Of Sanjiva Weerawarana
>>> Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 1:41 AM
>>> To: registry-dev at wso2.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic response
>>> formulation
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> Sanjiva.
>>>
>>> Jonathan Marsh wrote:
>>>
>>>> Does Axis2 currently ignore the Accept header when receiving a
>>>>
>>> message
>>>
>>>> without a SOAP envelope? (SOAP Response MEP)
>>>>
>>>> Jonathan Marsh - http://www.wso2.com -
>>>>
>>> http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: registry-dev-bounces at wso2.org [mailto:registry-dev-
>>>>> bounces at wso2.org] On Behalf Of Keith Chapman
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:49 PM
>>>>> To: registry-dev at wso2.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic response
>>>>> formulation
>>>>>
>>>>> Sanjiva Weerawarana wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> :) I like the penalty box model .. please help Keith out on axis-
>>>>>>
>>> dev
>>>
>>>>>> when he posts it there! (Or Keith you can point to this thread ..
>>>>>> might be a better way!)
>>>>>>
>>>>> I already dropped a proposal to the axis-dev list...
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Keith.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Sanjiva.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jonathan Marsh wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If we have to, though I don't like it much and it weakens the
>>>>>>>
>>>>> principle
>>>>>
>>>>>>> involved, which is to use the media type system in the most
>>>>>>>
>> simple
>>
>>>>> and
>>>>>
>>>>>>> direct way we can when we're playing REST. The ambiguity that
>>>>>>>
>>>>> text/xml
>>>>>
>>>>>>> could describe either an XML document or that XML document
>>>>>>>
>> wrapped
>>
>>>>> in
>>>>>
>>>>>>> a SOAP
>>>>>>> 1.1 envelope (or any other kind of wrapper) makes the solution
>>>>>>>
>>>>> tricky.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Occam's razor would suggest that text/xml represents the
>>>>>>>
>> simplest
>>
>>>>>>> alternative - the bare payload. If in some circumstances it
>>>>>>>
>>>>> represents
>>>>>
>>>>>>> something else (SOAP 1.1) and the fact that those circumstances
>>>>>>>
>>>>> aren't
>>>>>
>>>>>>> externally visible, loses some of the simplicity of the
>>>>>>>
>> proposal.
>>
>>>>>>> In the end, we're trying to use (not abuse) media types. If
>>>>>>>
>> SOAP
>>
>>>>> 1.1
>>>>>
>>>>>>> wanted
>>>>>>> special treatment within the media type system it should have
>>>>>>>
>>>>> defined a
>>>>>
>>>>>>> separate media type. I think it's reasonable to send SOAP 1.1
>>>>>>>
>> to
>>
>>>>> the
>>>>>
>>>>>>> penalty box for that violation when we're playing a REST
>>>>>>>
>>> tournament.
>>>
>>>>> I
>>>>>
>>>>>>> think the overlap between the community of SOAP 1.1 groupies and
>>>>>>>
>>>>> REST
>>>>>
>>>>>>> groupies is necessarily small (those who can live happily with
>>>>>>>
>>>>> cognitive
>>>>>
>>>>>>> dissonance) and therefore don't see much hope of keeping both
>>>>>>>
>> sets
>>
>>>>>>> happy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jonathan Marsh - http://www.wso2.com -
>>>>>>> http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: registry-dev-bounces at wso2.org [mailto:registry-dev-
>>>>>>>> bounces at wso2.org] On Behalf Of Glen Daniels
>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 12:50 PM
>>>>>>>> To: registry-dev at wso2.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic response
>>>>>>>> formulation
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sanjiva Weerawarana wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You'll have to ask on axis-dev and see whether people object.
>>>>>>>>>
>>> IMO
>>>
>>>>> its
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> decent compromise but there are more SOAP 1.1 fans on that
>>>>>>>>>
>> list
>>
>>>>> than
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> here!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> +1 from me for both the proposed solution and asking about it
>>>>>>>>
>> on
>>
>>>>>>>> axis-dev first.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There is still a switch I can use in service.xml to disable POX
>>>>>>>>
>>> for
>>>
>>>>> a
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> service/operation, right? So if I set that then I always get
>>>>>>>>
>>> SOAP
>>>
>>>>> on a
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> GET?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --Glen
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Keith Chapman wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Sanjiva Weerawarana wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> +1 for forgetting SOAP 1.1 and doing it .. .
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Great... Is this solution valid for Axis2 as well? If so I'll
>>>>>>>>>>
>>> go
>>>
>>>>>>>> ahead
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and implement this in Axis2. If there are multiple accept
>>>>>>>>>>
>>> headers
>>>
>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> use the first matching header.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>> Keith.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sanjiva.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jonathan Marsh wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll throw out an idea - text/xml and application/xml would
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> map
>>>
>>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> POX,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> application/soap+xml maps to SOAP 1.2, and we don't provide
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> a
>>
>>>>> way
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> do SOAP
>>>>>>>>>>>> 1.1 at this point in the browser. Eventually we could
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> register
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "application/data-format+xml" and a request of
>>>>>>>>>>>> "application/data-
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> format+xml;rddl=http://schemas.xmlsoap.org/soap/envelope/r
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ddl.html" (is that actually allowed in an accept header?)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> might
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> identify
>>>>>>>>>>>> soap 1.1.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jonathan Marsh - http://www.wso2.com -
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://auburnmarshes.spaces.live.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: registry-dev-bounces at wso2.org [mailto:registry-dev-
>>>>>>>>>>>>> bounces at wso2.org] On Behalf Of Keith Chapman
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 7:31 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: registry-dev at wso2.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Registry-dev] Accept types and dynamic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> response
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> formulation
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Paul Fremantle wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A while back Glen suggested we use Accept headers to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> automatically
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> send the right thing back to the browser / requester. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> was
>>
>>> a
>>>
>>>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> scared of this at the time :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> While trying to implement content negotiation in Axis2
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> using
>>
>>>>> the
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Accept
>>>>>>>>>>>>> header I came across the follllowing issue. When a REST
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> call
>>
>>>>>>>> (GET) is
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> sent using the browser the Accept header is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Accept:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> text/xml,application/xml,application/xhtml+xml,text/html;q=0.9,text/pla
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> in;q=0.8,image/png,*/*;q=0.5".
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now what should the response be POX or soap11?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Obviously I'd like to map text/xml to SOAP1.1 and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>> application/xml
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> POX
>>>>>>>>>>>>> but then the above request using the browser would return
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> SOAP
>>>
>>>>>>>> 1.1.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Which might not be user friendly and may mislead the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> user).
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Due to the above I haven't yet implemented this feature in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>> Axis2.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> suggested workarounds or just drop the feature?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Keith.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I think I'm coming round to this. I guess one of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>>>>>> key
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> RESTful design patterns is to have the web UI the *same*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>> thing
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> as the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> machine interface. I don't think we are there yet though
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> I
>>
>>>>> guess
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are getting closer. I suggest that we bash back and forth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>> some
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ideas
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about the exact URI design - in other words, what you see
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> if
>>>
>>>>> you
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> go
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> each different URI and what those patterns are. Glen - I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>> think
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> need to look at the APP spec in detail first.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Paul
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Sanjiva Weerawarana, Ph.D.
>>> Founder, Chairman & CEO; WSO2, Inc.; http://www.wso2.com/
>>> email: sanjiva at wso2.com; cell: +1 650 265 8311 | +94 77 787 6880
>>>
>>> "Oxygenating the Web Service Platform."
>>>
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>>>
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